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Nathan Smith's avatar

Re: "On the other side it repels theories like idealism or dualism, which either treat matter as illusory (only ideas really exist!), or else draw wide separation between matter and soul. (Cartesian dualism, for instance, treats the human body like a kind of ship which the soul can fly like a pilot. Hylomorphism rejects that. You are your body, but not just a body. You are, in a sense, a soul made flesh.)"

So it seems like you're positioning hylomorphism as the "Christian" philosophy here, and Cartesian dualism as... not.

I don't see how you can regard Cartesian dualism as less Christian-compatible than Aristotelian-style hylomorphism. "You are your body?" Then how can we say that the soul is immortal when the body dies? I assume the Aristotelians have some answer to that; far from pre-condemning it, I assume it's a bona fide faithful Christian opinion and all that, though I don't understand it. But it seems like a lot of things become problematic when you adopt this form of hylomorphism that have never seemed problematic for me, because I've always been more of a Cartesian dualist since that's always what the word "soul" seemed to mean. And it always seemed obvious to me that the real you is the part of you that thinks, the mind, the soul, and yes, your body is more like a vehicle than like your *self.* It's inconceivable to exist without your mind or soul; it's very conceivable to exist without your body.

Were the ancient Church fathers really "hylomorphist" in any articulate way?

Nathan Smith's avatar

So this is fascinating, but the big question I have to ask is: what does this have to do with Christianity?

Christian compatible, yes. But "Christian philosophy?" It happened that these ideas were worked out by certain Christians, particularly Thomas Aquinas. But why should we think that's anything more than historical accident? Why not speak of Christian physics because Newton was a Christian, or Christian chemistry?

What would clarify that this is actually *Christian* philosophy, in some more or less essential way, would be a rigorous derivation of these ideas from scripture or from early church councils that nearly all modern Christians accept as authoritative. I wouldn't even know where to begin to argue this from scripture.

That said, I think there is a roundabout way of arguing for something like hylomorphism (though it's a term I've never heard before this chat) as being especially Christian, by negation. If you're seeking a coherent worldview, you have to somehow unify a lot of disparate things. Christianity offers one way to do that, which doesn't pin down a lot of philosophical pre-commitments. Without Christianity, the search for coherence tends to drill down into ontology and epistemology end in reductionism. Let that stand as a placeholder for a longer argument.

As it is, though, I think the weakness of this piece is that you assert that you're describing Christian philosophy, but the philosophical arguments you put forward, while plausible, seem crazily disconnected from anything that any normal person recognizes as specially Christian.

And the dog example makes the problem sharpest, by going out on an uncomfortable limb. Some dogs don't fetch sticks. That's not actually bad. We could quibble over the specific traits of a "good" dog, but that seems rather silly, gratuitously arbitrary, and symptomatic of a philosophical error that makes a high stakes philosophical question out of something that should be subjective and innocuous. The apple tree example works better, but only because hylomorphism is clearly standing in for sociobiology. An apple tree that doesn't bear fruit is defective because its kind could not persist in the world. There's no union of form and matter that needs to be postulated to explain this, or to give a warrant for its extension beyond life.

I think there is a need for something like hylomorphism in order to address the problem of induction. Aristotelian telos conflates a philosophical move that is ultimately needed to skepticism with a broad generalization taken from biology that modern evolution fully supplants.

Of course, that's a much larger topic. But my critique here, again, is the total lack of any justification for the claim that these philosophical moves are specifically Christian.

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